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Post by azwood on Dec 13, 2018 6:21:00 GMT -5
The turbine shafts 30mm not sure I need it that big I could machine it to say 25mm it depends on what the bearings I get are rated to speed wise.
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CH3NO2
Senior Member
Joined: March 2017
Posts: 455 
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Post by CH3NO2 on Dec 13, 2018 6:34:03 GMT -5
A few more pics the wheels a funny shape compared to what I've seen.so if I understand correctly the ngv and the way it hits the wheel depends on the given gas flow i have to run it right?. Great find for a slab of beer Azwood! I suspect if you can fabricate a shroud for the turbine and operate it at its mass flow and pressure potential, it will yield extreme power. I'd buy that for a slab of beer...And I can only guess what a slab of beer is. |
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Post by azwood on Dec 14, 2018 5:22:38 GMT -5
A few more pics the wheels a funny shape compared to what I've seen.so if I understand correctly the ngv and the way it hits the wheel depends on the given gas flow i have to run it right?. Great find for a slab of beer Azwood! I suspect if you can fabricate a shroud for the turbine and operate it at its mass flow and pressure potential, it will yield extreme power. I'd buy that for a slab of beer...And I can only guess what a slab of beer is. When you say shroud do you mean like a style turbo housing that's what I had in mind just not sure about vains and such I also was thinking a 4in inlet might work considering that's what I run out of my gas producer.not sure where your from but a slabs a 24 pack of beer $50 Australian. |
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Post by pitciblackscotland on Dec 14, 2018 7:20:56 GMT -5
Great find for a slab of beer Azwood! I suspect if you can fabricate a shroud for the turbine and operate it at its mass flow and pressure potential, it will yield extreme power. I'd buy that for a slab of beer...And I can only guess what a slab of beer is. When you say shroud do you mean like a style turbo housing that's what I had in mind just not sure about vains and such I also was thinking a 4in inlet might work considering that's what I run out of my gas producer.not sure where your from but a slabs a 24 pack of beer $50 Australian. This video from JetA1Terminator should give you some ideas. www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDT2tu03OM8 |
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CH3NO2
Senior Member
Joined: March 2017
Posts: 455
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Post by CH3NO2 on Dec 14, 2018 9:27:59 GMT -5
When you say shroud do you mean like a style turbo housing that's what I had in mind just not sure about vains and such I also was thinking a 4in inlet might work considering that's what I run out of my gas producer.not sure where your from but a slabs a 24 pack of beer $50 Australian. It looks like the turbo is missing some kind of insert that covers the profile of the turbine from the inducer to exducer. Not really sure, but if that's the case, you should be able to machine one in a lathe without too much hassle. I'm in the US. I figured on a 24 pack but otherwise never heard of it named like that before. In the US we call it a "Case" but I like the name "Slab". It sounds heavy.... and more fun to drink.  |
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Post by azwood on Dec 22, 2018 0:06:12 GMT -5
OK so I'm not understanding one part of the free power equation here I have a 65mm nozzle on my jet pipe that gives me thrust by accelerating the gas flow I have I get how that works but when converting that to a power wheel do I keep the same volume as the 65mm 3421smm I think it was and make that the total volume of the ngv which doesn't work with the 40mm wide one it should run I know I'll need to make a new one anyway.or is it more about ngv angle to the wheel.I know I still need those magic numbers from the pitot and thrust etc but the concepts given me a headache.
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Post by racket on Dec 22, 2018 1:13:03 GMT -5
Hi Aaron
If your 65 mm diameter jet nozzle makes your engine work with the desired jetpipe temperature at the desired P2, then we need to provide sufficient "restriction" through the entire freepower stage ( NGV plus wheel) to produce the same jetpipe temps and P2 pressure .
Ideally we have a total jetpipe pressure P4t from a pitot in the jetpipe to work from , we can then divide up that pressure drop to suit the turbine wheel we are using , the division of pressure can be fiddled with a bit , it need not be a 50/50 split.
From your pics it looks like the NGV throat is 40 mm wide , so if we divide 40 into your 3421 sq mms we get ~85.5 mm which would be the total height of all your NGV throats if you wanted to use an "impulse" arragement with all pressure drop in the NGV , you could always blank off some of the vane flow areas to produce the 3421 sq mm throat area if currently the throat area is greater.
Cheers
John
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Post by azwood on Dec 22, 2018 3:32:49 GMT -5
Hi Aaron If your 65 mm diameter jet nozzle makes your engine work with the desired jetpipe temperature at the desired P2, then we need to provide sufficient "restriction" through the entire freepower stage ( NGV plus wheel) to produce the same jetpipe temps and P2 pressure . Ideally we have a total jetpipe pressure P4t from a pitot in the jetpipe to work from , we can then divide up that pressure drop to suit the turbine wheel we are using , the division of pressure can be fiddled with a bit , it need not be a 50/50 split. From your pics it looks like the NGV throat is 40 mm wide , so if we divide 40 into your 3421 sq mms we get ~85.5 mm which would be the total height of all your NGV throats if you wanted to use an "impulse" arragement with all pressure drop in the NGV , you could always blank off some of the vane flow areas to produce the 3421 sq mm throat area if currently the throat area is greater. Cheers John Thanks again that does help a lot sometimes not understanding something that I'm working on keeps me up at night I have a overactive mind lol I'm sure I'm not the only one.working through problems like this is what makes it so rewarding when things are finally done. |
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Post by azwood on Dec 22, 2018 3:43:57 GMT -5
But yeah the ngv that cum with the wheel is 40mm wide so thats how wide it need to be right.but like you said I could use only say 180 degrees or so of the wheel if that adds up to my area needed is the angle of the stock ngv the optermum angle to use to or is that something I can change to suit my needs
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Post by racket on Dec 22, 2018 3:51:53 GMT -5
Hi Aaron
LOL...........Yep ,I understand :-)
Your freepower wheel is a mixed flow type by the look of the inducer and overall flow area is pretty large , so I'd be going with a pure impulse type of arrangement , just blank off every third or fourth NGV passageway to get the desired 3421 sq mm throat area.
Yeh , its good when things finally workout............you're making great progress :-)
Cheers
John
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Post by racket on Dec 22, 2018 3:55:47 GMT -5
Hi Aaron
I'd just go with the stock NGV and close off some flow passageways rather than make your own NGV , its a shit of a job and due to the wheel you are using your options would be limited, the current NGV looks as though the outlet angle is down ~20 degrees which is pretty good , anything less than ~15 degrees and the losses can increase from too much vane surface area.
Cheers
John
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Post by azwood on Dec 22, 2018 4:41:59 GMT -5
Think its missing something here  |
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Post by pitciblackscotland on Dec 22, 2018 5:22:31 GMT -5
Did the turbo have a heat shield  Like this one on my T 30 turbo. Did the NGV have any lugs to fasten it down onto the turbine scroll housing Have a look at these photos. By looking at the photo of your NGV i can't see any thing missing, if you got the turbo in one piece. Cheers, Mark.   |
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Post by azwood on Dec 22, 2018 7:08:42 GMT -5
It does have the lugs that fasten it to the inner scroll but is it supposed to have a big gap between the ngv and wheel seems like that would defeat the purpose of having it
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Post by pitciblackscotland on Dec 22, 2018 7:43:47 GMT -5
How big is the gap? The T30 had a gap see pic. Now is the time to start your research on this turbo and find a parts diagram for it, it took me about a week to get info for the T30 and that was sending a bunch of emails to turbo repair shops all over the world but did get a parts diagram and specs for the turbo. You need to be persistent and you will find what your looking for. I have been looking for parts for my Sachs Wankel engine and have found a chap in Germany who will help me out. Cheers, Mark.  |
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Like this one on my T 30 turbo. Did the NGV have any lugs to fasten it down onto the turbine scroll housing