MRT-02 new turbine project (ideas and suggestions?)

[miuge]

Hi guys!

It's been a while since my last post, I've just been watching and following these stunning projects you've posted recently.. And surprisingly I got a bad "turbine fever" by myself
In case you've missed this, we have earlier built a turboshaft powered minibike (now in a million pieces): jetandturbineowners.proboards.com/thread/509/turboshaft-minibike-mrt-01

The new project has to be A LOT more powerful and probably a tad more reliable and practical (oil pump and starting issues).
Yet I have no time to do a complete engine, but turbocharger based engine would probably fit in my schedule. Also it has to fit in my budget

I've browsed big turbochargers occasionally from ebay, but haven't found anything big and cheap enough. Recently I was browsing chinese turbochargers and found out they offer Holset HX80-85 models too. Probably could give a try for one with a warranty or good reputation.
HX82s seems to have ~100/150mm compressor and ~110/130mm turbine wheels, I've seen specs of the HX85 which show as much as 120mm inducer comp wheels... 

What do you think? Right now I'm open for suggestions and ideas.


Thanks,
Mikko

[racket]

Hi Mikko

Sounds good :-)

The 118 mm inducered wheel I'm using in the 12/118 engine is an "upgrade" comp wheel for a HX82 .................theres no substitute for a "big hole in the front" .

What sort of price are they asking for the turbos ??

As long as you keep the temps and rpm at reasonable levels they should survive ............LOL, theres a lot of "reputable" turbos/replacement parts made in china then have a "made in the USA" price tag applied.

A Link would be handy so we can check them out.

Cheers
John

[madpatty]

Hi Miuge,

Just for a reference if in case you need any.

m.ebay.com/itm?itemId=251420411832

I have bought one and its in perfect condition.

But take care they are reverse rotation ones.

Cheers,
Patty

[racket]

Hi Patty

What size are the wheels ??

Cheers
John

[madpatty]

Hi Racket,

Compressor- 89,140mm
Turbine - only exducer measured(105mm)

Cheers,
Patty

[racket]

Hi Patty

Thanks .

Mid sized inducer , big sized turb exducer

Cheers
John

[miuge]

Hi John and Patty,

Thanks for the comments. For some reason I want to go bigger than 100mm inducer, so that's "no" for the HX80

Yeah I know there's a lot of made in China parts with USA tags and price tags...
I have to make inquiries to see more precisely what's available, the turbochargers are usually offered just with a reference part number and no diameters are displayed. Would like to get actual pictures of the products too, reference image might not tell the whole truth
Do you guys know any other +100mm comp inducer turbochargers or big engine models equipped with such unit? That could ease my searching.
Price range for the China HX80-85 series is about 250-500$


-Mikko

[Johansson]

You can always build a twin turbo engine, 2x100mm should give a decent push. :-)

[racket]

Hi Mikko

Theres not a lot of "modern" turbos to choose from with 100+ mm inducers, there are a few old tank turbos but the turbine wheel material can be the weak part, so they can't be "pushed" without the risks involved

Garrett have the GT6041 like the one on Smithys kart jetandturbineowners.proboards.com/thread/568/again-gt6041-powered-green-beast with a 106mm inducer , Garrett also make some larger ones but they're "not available to the public" .

The Holset/Cummins HX82 etc are probably a better turbos to look at rather than the GT6041 as theres more options available as they run turbine wheels with a quill that the comp slips over rather than a screw on comp like the GT6041.

I'd be wary of that $US500 price tag for such a large turbo , it costs that just for the turbine wheel normally .

If you checkout the KTS catalogue ktsturbobilletx.com/ under the HX 82 etc , you'll find some numbers that might be helpful.

Columbus diesel www.columbusdieselsupply.com/images/prostockturbos.pdf do very expensive tractor pulling upgrades on the HX82 and HC5A turbos

Cheers
John

[racket]

Hi Mikko

Precision do a range of big turbos www.precisionturbo.net/Street-and-Race/ss/2-000--HP/7 , though expensive.

I checked on one of my favourite Sites for info about the HX82 www.turbomaster.info/eng/catalogs/model.php?base=holset&pagina=HX82 but the info is all "restricted" , bummer.

Turbonetics also have some up to 115 mm inducer www.turboneticsinc.com/performance/products/turbochargers/thumper.

With your machining skills , I think you'd be able to remachine the comp housing to take a larger inducered wheel .

Cheers
John

[miuge]

Hi Anders,

Twin turbine in that size would be way too heavy and requires too much space Everything should fit in a kart or bike frame...

John, larger wheel fitted into housing could be one option, no problem with that. What turbine side should be used then? New turbos like precision and turbonetics are out of budget, I've checked their selections too.
While searching for the big wheels I discovered this ProCharger F-3X-143 Supercharger   143mm would be manly, heheh...

I believe those 500$ units could cope our infrequent use, it wouldn't be a daily driven I already got a couple of offers.. HX-series turbo 97,5/150mm comp 111,5/125mm turb, I think it is available with single scroll housing too. Are the diameters in a right ballpark figure?

E: Finnish Holset dealer states 1,47kg/sec (195 lbs/min) for a similar unit.

[racket]

Hi Mikko

LOL......the procharger is a decent size , potentially ~5.4 lbs.sec and requiring >500 HP to drive it at a decent boost .

The 97.5/150 comp mated up to a 111.5/125 mm turb would be very similar to our TV94 rotative with their ~98/141 comp and 106/129 turb , if it comes with the right sized A/R single hole turb scroll at $500 its a bargain and the flow matches up with an Allison C20 4th stage freepower wheel rather well , anything much bigger and there'll be problems finding a suitable freepower .

Please provide more details of the supplier as I'm certain there'll be interest by other member at that price :-)

The Holset flow figures of 1.47 kgs/s - 195 lbs/min are when the comp is flowing its max flow well into the choke range of the map at ~60% efficiency , we need to have the flow at max efficiency which means less flow , design for ~1.1 kgs/sec which is what we roughly do with the TV94 comps .

With the slightly larger turb exducer compared to the TV94 you'd have no problems flowing a 106mm inducered comp if you ever wanted to upgrade.

Have you looked for locomotive turbochargers ??

A few years ago I was looking and there were some fairly big units available in china.

Cheers
John

[ausjet]

I am also in the early construction stages of a large holset based gt. I have a HX82 with a divided turbine scroll and a HC5A which is almost the same as a HX82- different compressor housings I think and a bit older. This is the one I'm using. These turbos are widely used in tractor pulling, there's a handful of different turbine housings avaliable although price & freight may be an issue. Rebuild kits are also cheap.
Some of the HX83's have a pwm speed sensor screwed into the centre housing that picks up off a notch in the shaft too!

[racket]

Pics please ausjet :-)

[miuge]

Yet no breakthrough in turbo search, just lot's of different price HX83s everywhere and no over 100mm inducer ones.. I'll try my luck with HX85 part numbers or HE851 which came across lately. Some HE-series units seem to have rectangular single scroll turb housing.
One interesting finding was a Holset HT100 turbo 

What's the limit that C20 4th stage wheel can accept?